In the aftermath of the controversy over the cartoons of Islam's Prophet Muhammad, the Internet edition of the Norwegian daily Dagbladet interviewed Kurdish Iraqi Islamist Mullah Krekar. In it, Krekar expounded his views on relations between Islam and the West. Krekar, whose real name is Najm Al-Din Faraj Ahmad, came to Norway as a refugee in 1991, where he established the Islamist Ansar Al-Islam organization. He is currently slated for deportation from Norway.

The following are excerpts from the interview: [1]

"The Western Way of Thinking has Taken its Materialism, Egoism, and Savagery From the Ancient Greeks and Romans"

Krekar: "On one side stands the Western way of thinking. This is a way of thinking that has taken its materialism, egoism and savagery from the ancient Greeks and Romans. This is a way of thinking that has altered true Christianity. An example of this is that Western Christianity [today] accepts men having sex with men. That was never accepted by Jesus. On the other side stands Islam, and now the West is trying to take over and change Islam in the same way that Christianity was debased."

Interviewer: "Do you mean that this is a war between civilizations?"

Krekar: "No. There is only one civilization. But there are different ways of thinking about it, and our way of thinking in Islam stands in opposition to the Western way of thinking. Today it is our way of thinking that comes in and shows itself stronger than theirs. Islam has a stable foundation: one God, one Prophet, one Koran, and one tradition. This generates hatred among [those with a] Western way of thinking, and leads the losing party to use violence. And that is the violence and war against Islam."

Democracy is Just an Excuse - It's Islam the West Can't Stand

Interviewer: "What grounds do you have for saying that there is a war against Islam?"

Krekar: "The spread of democracy is just an excuse. The same with the hunt for Osama bin Laden - it's just an excuse. It is Islam that the West can't stand... The attack on Islam is like a hand. One finger is the war in Iraq and Afghanistan. Another finger is the imprisonment of Muslims at Guantanamo Bay. The third finger is the publishing of the pictures of the Prophet Muhammad. We must see things as they are, and those pictures [of Muhammad] are one part of the military fight that the West is conducting against Islam..."

"By 2050, 30% of the European Population Will Be Muslim"

Interviewer: "What do you mean when you say that the Islamic way of thinking is stronger than the Western way of thinking?"

Krekar: "We have no fear of the Western way of thinking. It can never win. In Iraq the two sides stand one against the other. On the side of Islam stand men who love death and who are willing to become martyrs for what they believe in. On the other side stand soldiers who fight for $1000 a day. The number of dead American soldiers is proof of failure. The same is true in Afghanistan. From 2001 to 2004, there were five suicide attacks. In 2005 there were 17.

"While the front of the U.S. and its allies is becoming smaller, Islam is widening its front. The reports from Guantanamo show the same. They are trying to rip belief from the hearts of the Muslims. It doesn't work. In Denmark they published cartoons, but the result was only to encourage people to rally behind Islam. I and all Muslims are proof [of this]. They have not managed to change us. It is we who will change them."

Interviewer: "How?"

Krekar: "Look at the development of the population in Europe, where the number of Muslims increases like mosquitoes. Each Western woman in the E.U. produces, on average, 1.4 children. Each Muslim woman in these same countries produces 3.5 children. By 2050, 30% of the European population will be Muslim..."

We are Fighting for the Same Goal as bin Laden - Just Under Different Circumstances

Interviewer: "Is it right to import the military part of the war that is underway into Europe?"

Krekar: "No. This I cannot support. But Muslims who go to Afghanistan and Iraq to fight, that is an honor. It is an honor in itself if it violates the laws here in Europe."

Interviewer: "'In itself,' meaning [that European law is violated by] fighting together with Osama bin Laden, Al-Qaeda, and other groups that use terror?"

Krekar: "Those who say that Osama bin Laden is a terrorist are themselves killing our women, children, and civilians. This is what we see and know. We are not influenced by the U.S.'s words against bin Laden, since they are talking about someone we know. We are fighting for the same goal, just under different circumstances.

"The goal is Islamic rule in an Islamic state. Shi'ite Muslims have achieved this goal in Iran, and they are so strong that the West doesn't dare attack. This is the only way we can maintain a balance [of power] and achieve a lasting peace."

Interviewer: "Is the goal to re-establish the Caliphate - the Islamic rule that was established by the Prophet?"

Krekar: "Yes. Our Caliph is dead and we are orphans. Therefore we are fighting, like the Jews fought under David Ben-Gurion, for our own state, a state ruled by a true Islamic ruler."

Bin Laden is a Good Person to Rule the Caliphate

Interviewer: "What borders should the Caliphate have?"

Krekar: "It doesn't matter. Things are born, and then they grow bigger. The essential thing is Islamic rule. That was why the West destroyed the Taliban's rule in Afghanistan. They feared the Islamic state."

Interviewer: "Who should rule the new Caliphate?"

Krekar: "It doesn't have to be a cleric. A good human being is enough."

Interviewer: "Is bin Laden such a person?"

Krekar: "Osama bin Laden and Ayman Al-Zawahiri are among several good people. Weren't Jewish leaders also terrorists before they had their own state?..."

Life in Europe has No Value for Muslims

Interviewer: "Most of the Muslims in the Western world have made these countries their home. What is your message to them?"

Krekar: "Muslims in the West and in Norway don't want to understand that this is not their country. The Muslim state will be their home, no matter where it is located. Muslims in the West are like the Jews were. We are homeless and weak, and will remain so until we create our own country. Life here has no value for Muslims."

Interviewer: "What do you say to Muslims in the West who fully participate in both society and political life?"

Krekar: "They can participate in elections and elect Carl I. Hagen or Kristin Halvorsen, but in itself they have no value for society. When we get our own country, like the Shi'ites created in Iran, then Muslims will have full political and economic control."

Interviewer: "What role do you see Muslims in Europe playing?"

Krekar: "We have no role to play at this point. Our position is to maintain our numerical strength. But now you are putting us in the role of the accused. It is you and the West who should be telling us what [the West] can do for us. The West should protect Islam, and not the other way around."

Interviewer: "Isn't it that same freedom of expression and freedom of religion that allowed the publishing of the Muhammad cartoons also your best protection for expressing your views and beliefs?"

Krekar: "I am protected by the law in this country, but it is not a law that protects Muslims in particular. Neither could it protect Muslims against the attack that these cartoons were. It is not the West that is the victim in this case."